“Then I heard one saint speaking, and another saint said unto that certain saint which spake, How long shall be the vision concerning the daily sacrifice, and the transgression of desolation, to give both the sanctuary and the host to be trodden under foot?”
My Notes
What Does Daniel 8:13 Mean?
One angel asks another: how long will the vision last — how long will the daily sacrifice be suspended, the transgression of desolation continue, and the sanctuary and God's people be trampled? The question comes from a heavenly being, not a human, suggesting that even angels want to understand God's timeline.
The phrase "the transgression of desolation" (or "the desolation that makes desolate") describes a specific desecration of the Temple — an act so profane that it leaves the holy place devastated. Historically, this is associated with Antiochus Epiphanes (167 BC), who desecrated the Temple by sacrificing a pig on the altar and installing a statue of Zeus.
The questioner is called "Palmoni" in the margin — "the numberer of secrets" or "the wonderful numberer." This mysterious figure counts hidden things. Even among angels, there are specialists in divine mysteries. The question of timing — how long — is addressed to the one who numbers God's secrets.
Reflection Questions
- 1.Does knowing that even angels ask 'how long?' comfort you in your own waiting?
- 2.What 'sanctuary' in your life is currently being trampled?
- 3.How does knowing there's a specific number — a finite count — change how you endure desolation?
- 4.What does the 'wonderful numberer' teach about God's relationship to timing and divine secrets?
Devotional
Even the angels want to know: how long? The heavenly beings watching the vision ask the question that every suffering person asks: when does this end? How long will the sanctuary be trampled? How long will desolation last?
The fact that angels ask this question is comforting. If celestial beings — who have access to God's presence, who serve in His throne room, who understand things humans can't — still ask "how long," then the question isn't faithless. It's universal. Even heaven wants to know the timeline.
The "wonderful numberer" — the angel who counts God's secrets — is addressed because the answer involves numbers. The response (verse 14) gives a specific count: 2,300 evenings and mornings. God doesn't say "soon" or "eventually." He gives a number. The timeline is specific, even if the interpretation is debated.
The trampling of the sanctuary — the holy place given over to desecration — describes a season where the sacred is publicly violated. The daily sacrifice stops. The desolation occupies the holy ground. And the question is: how long will God allow His own dwelling place to be profaned?
The answer is: there's a number. The trampling has a count. The desolation has an expiration date. It may be longer than you want — 2,300 evenings and mornings is years, not days — but it's finite. The wonderful numberer has counted, and the count ends.
Commentary
Trusted original commentary from respected historical Bible scholars and theologians.
Then I heard one saint speaking,.... An angel, either a created angel, pure and holy in his nature, as Gabriel; or the…
Then I heard one saint speaking - One holy one. The vision was now ended, and the prophet represents himself now as…
One saint speaking, and another saint said - One angel asked another how long the sanctuary was to be trodden down?
Here is, I. The date of this vision, Dan 8:1. It was in the third year of the reign of Belshazzar, which proved to be…
A dialogue between two angels, which is overheard by Daniel, and the object of which is evidently to inform Daniel how…
Cross References
Related passages throughout Scripture